SPEAKER_03 0:00

Here comes the sun do. Here comes the sun that say it's all right.

SPEAKER_05 0:20

Hello everyone and welcome to Fortitude. I am your host, Heather Kittleson, and I have my fantastic husband, Amos Kittleson. Hello. And our guests today are probably two of the most charismatic, beautiful people in the Sioux Falls area. Oh, wow. Uh-huh. I have had the opportunity to meet them, I would say about six, seven years ago. Travis and Jessica Remy, thank you so much for being here with Amos and I to speak about your journey. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 0:50

Appreciate it. Glad to be here. Yes. Thanks for having us.

SPEAKER_05 0:53

So exciting. So when we met, what, six years ago? It was it was at referrals.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

Yeah, so that would have been 2016. Yep.

SPEAKER_05 1:01

At a referrals group. And I it's not there was something about Travis that I that I was drawn to because he's random, he's funny, he has a a spirit and a sense of humor that's just it's just good. It's just good. And then I met his beautiful bride a couple years. Actually, I showed up to your benefit at golf addiction. Yeah. That was the first time.

SPEAKER_01 1:24

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:24

And I remember you warning Jessica. When she comes in, be ready. Do you remember that?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:32

You warned her because when Heather comes in, she comes in hot for a big old hug. Yes. Yep. Yes. He did.

SPEAKER_01 1:37

I thought that was worth a warning.

SPEAKER_05 1:39

Uh-huh. It was. So thank you for embracing the hug that I gave you that. Oh yeah. We had good conversation that day, too. There was a lot to talk about. There was. So you two have been on a journey that is in the past two years, two and three. It's been three years since. Four. Four. It's been four years already. Yeah. Okay. Four and a half, actually. Okay. Goll. Time's goes by. So Evelyn, I was pregnant with Evy when we went and had coffee.

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:07

Yeah, there we go.

SPEAKER_05 2:08

Well, I would I'd love to just jump in and have both of you and whoever wants to speak can start, whatever works for you too, and lead the conversation with our audience as to who you are. Tell us a little about where you reside, live, your kids, all this stuff that uh makes you who you are currently and today.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

Cool. Can we include that we're living in an RV right now?

SPEAKER_05 2:29

Yes, you can. I want I want it all.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Very good. Yeah. It's actually been kind of fun living in a camper. What what would you rate it? One through ten, Jessica.

SPEAKER_04 2:39

I think I would I'd rate it, yeah, probably an eight. Okay. A solid eight. All right. Maybe that's higher than I expected. I mean, we can't we can't that is higher than expected. Yeah, I I'm sleeping with one child and he has to sleep on the opposite end of the camper because he doesn't fit on the bed.

unknown 2:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 2:58

And how many weeks?

SPEAKER_01 3:00

So uh 12 nights, four to go. Okay. Not that counters a fixed time. I'm a counter though, you know. So just count down and counting down. Counting up in this case.

SPEAKER_05 3:09

So how did you end up in a camper?

SPEAKER_01 3:12

Well, I'm I'm glad that you asked about that. Uh we are uh we sold our house, uh, which was a God thing. You know, God's timing is never our timing, and um we had talk up talked about doing that um and were approached and uh sold our house.

SPEAKER_04 3:26

We didn't have our house in the market. Someone walked up to your door and asked.

SPEAKER_01 3:29

There was no Keller Williams sign in our yard. Are they they the big ones?

SPEAKER_04 3:33

And we talked about moving for the last two years. And actually, where we're moving to, last summer we were pretty set on buying a lot.

SPEAKER_05 3:44

Oh. So you're now there's a house right there. Okay, yeah. So you where is your can't you're you're in Rock Rapids, is your where you live. Rock Rapids, Iowa.

SPEAKER_01 3:55

That's right. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 3:56

You're gonna give her the address?

SPEAKER_01 3:57

Uh 29 Alpine Drive, the big place. Uh 29 Island Park Drive. For our audience, please don't show up at the door. Yeah, I'm not sure. Actually, we will be there by the time this city is.

SPEAKER_05 4:09

Yeah, that is the river address down by the river. Yeah. So you're living in a camper down by the river with your two sons. Yep. And what are their names?

SPEAKER_01 4:16

Braxton and Gavin.

SPEAKER_05 4:18

Okay. And what do you both do for profession?

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 4:25

Well, we have visiting angels, home care in Sioux Falls.

SPEAKER_03 4:29

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 4:30

And um, so I do that. I stepped away from hair. I did hair uh for 15 or so years, a little over 15 years. And um yeah, stepped from behind the chair and now I'm in the office. And I also run the Oakland Foundation, 501c3 nonprofit organization, which everyone that is listening is gonna hear that into great detail in just a minute.

SPEAKER_05 4:57

Yeah. Travis, what do you do?

SPEAKER_01 4:59

I uh don't really have anything to do with visiting angels anymore, but I could, because I start I helped start that and it was fun. And uh you you do most of the work there now. I just pretend like I'm important with that. Yeah, but uh I'm uh you laughed at this earlier, so I'm not so sure. I'm kind of self-conscious about it now, but I'm a pastor at Rock Rapids United Methodist Church. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 5:22

I don't think it's funny at all did Jessica, just for the record.

SPEAKER_01 5:25

So she's ironic, funny.

SPEAKER_05 5:26

Beautiful that you're a pastor. It is beautiful, but it's it is not a man that I married at all. Yeah. Because the man you married was what? Jess.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

6'3, 220.

SPEAKER_05 5:39

Still that.

SPEAKER_01 5:40

Yeah. So I mean, what's it what's the big deal?

SPEAKER_05 5:43

Let's go spiritually.

SPEAKER_04 5:46

Um well, and I always feel I anytime we talk about our story, I feel like my version and your version are just a little bit different.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

Sometimes.

SPEAKER_04 5:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Maybe that's like us.

SPEAKER_04 5:58

You see things differently, you know, from different perspective. So the man I married was um uh not Christ-centered. Um did not grow up going to church. Um not what I thought I would marry. Thought I'd marry someone that wore cowboy boots and he did after we were married for a while. I got him to wear cowboy boots and do all the things he said he wouldn't do. But um, yeah, he if you would have told me back then that he's gonna be a pastor, I I probably would have fallen over dead.

SPEAKER_05 6:38

And if you all can see Travis, which we are gonna take a selfie after this, but he's wearing a pink polo right now, which it looks good. Thanks, guys.

SPEAKER_01 6:47

Thank you. Yeah, or specifically for this recording.

SPEAKER_04 6:49

And a little bit that we only have like seven outfits in our camper. Yes. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 6:55

That will change soon. Yeah, soon. Yeah. Your time is closing in, but you will be in this beautiful new home. So four and a half years ago, you have two beautiful little boys, and you are pregnant with your third. And explain a little bit your pregnancy was beautiful. So I want to get into your story and kind of just jump right in. Yeah. I'm just turn it over to you, Jess.

SPEAKER_04 7:24

So I I actually am one of the very few that loves being pregnant. Um, my pregnancies are always easy. I don't have the morning sickness. Um, I mean, I was a little sick maybe with Gavin, but um no, I feel some of them I think the best when I'm pregnant. And uh my pregnancy with the third was no different than the other two. We didn't know what we were having, so that we never find out. We always think that's one of the cool surprises that God gives you in life. And so we we never find out. Um, but yeah, we we were set to have a uh perfect, healthy baby.

SPEAKER_05 8:01

Because there was no signs, none, none that there was any.

SPEAKER_04 8:04

I had um I had an inkling um at 30, I think it was like 34, 36 weeks that something was wrong. Um, just this gut instinct. I felt very disconnected with my third pregnancy uh compared to the other two. And at about 34, 36 weeks, I contacted my doctor, my OB, and just said, I just feel like something's wrong. And she's like, Oh, no worries, come in, we'll hook you up. And they did all the things and took, went in and did an ultrasound, and everything was perfect. In fact, the ultrasound text said to me, like, here are your baby's organs. She went through everything, it was like the longest ultrasound ever. Um, and now looking back, I'm like, why did why did she do that? Like, why did she go the extra mile for me in the middle of her day? Like, why did she do that? And I feel that that was totally a God thing because there was no way to detect what was going on beforehand. And that just showed that there was, I mean, we had the ultrasound. They pointed out every one of her organs, everything was beautiful and fine, and they sent me home. And yeah, at 30 maybe 39 weeks. Yeah, I think so. We decided to induce because this baby was a little bit bigger than what the boys were. Um, and so just for precautionary, my doctor was like, you know what, we're ready to go. Let's let's have this baby. Uh another blessing, because your brother was just leaving that next day for Florida to live. Yeah. Um, and so that worked out the way it was supposed to as well.

SPEAKER_05 9:50

But so he was able to be there at the hospital with y'all when I happened okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

He's one of the very few that held Oakland. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:56

Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:58

So So you get there, you get induced. Mm-hmm. And yeah, and actually that that morning, I think we had an argument of some sort. It was stressful morning.

SPEAKER_01 10:10

I don't remember that.

SPEAKER_04 10:10

Oh, I do. We did, yeah. And I drove to the the hospital by myself. You had to bring the kids to school, and I think you had some stuff at visiting angels that you had to have done, get done.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 10:20

So I mean, I was there like all ready to go, had my hair all done, and this was different.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

This was the first time you were being induced, so it was a little bit of a different process. We weren't driving to the hospital with you having contractions and or anything like that. So, yes, there I there was not as much of a time element for me.

SPEAKER_05 10:35

Yeah, no. No, so I was induced with all of them but one. So I that whole process is weird. You go, you just like you're watching. You just show up and they're just birth appointments.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

That's right. So we're gonna have your baby at three o'clock tomorrow. Yeah, three o'clock time side. Check your calendar. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 10:54

It's almost it's almost hard to wrap harder to wrap your head around that. Like you have a scheduled time to go push this baby out of your and all of a sudden you're gonna have another child, you know. Yeah, so you have to versus if it's just happening, it happens. You don't need to think about it.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

We have to react to these contractions that you're having. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 11:10

So it's ready, go time. This is why like eh, Lass of Days a call, just in.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

That's exactly what the day was because I remember that day specifically as it being fun, joyful. Um, I was poking fun at you like I always do, and you were receiving it well, and we were having a great day because it was gonna be a great day because we were about to have our third child. And number one and two went so perfect, and the doctor even said uh this is gonna be easy. Like she was it was just gonna be a walk in the park. And we were we were walking around trying to get those contractions going, and we were um talking about the signs on the wall and the uh maternity ward there or whatever you call where you're yeah, yeah, before you have the baby labor and delivery and uh it was just a great day. Yeah, uh really was. I remember that very specifically that um uh yeah, it was just a joyous day. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 11:55

So contractions kick in.

SPEAKER_04 11:58

Yeah, everything went really fast.

SPEAKER_01 12:00

All of a sudden, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 12:02

Yeah, all of a sudden. That's how all my kids are born, just all of a sudden. Uh-huh. Um and yeah, I mean, it was so lighthearted to the point where our nurse, Abby, who is now a dear friend of mine, crazy how things work. She was like 36 preg weeks pregnant at the time. And um, so her and our doctor were like making bet placing bets on how many pushes it would take.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

Yeah, the one said one push and the other said two pushes.

SPEAKER_04 12:30

Because Braxton, it was like three out. Gavin was two. Yeah. So they were all placing bets on yeah, that's how lighthearted things were.

SPEAKER_05 12:39

Jess, you and I are a lot of like in that sense of our like, because I same pregnancy deliveries. I always feel bad telling people that because I'm like, it's so easy.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

There was a little element with Oakland um that I was like concerned about having to deliver a baby in the car. So, you know, part of this.

SPEAKER_04 12:56

Well, that's the other reason they induced us.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

That part of the reason, or part of it was like, okay, cool, at least I'm not gonna have to worry about doing that because you know, it was it was somewhat close the other two times.

SPEAKER_05 13:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:05

So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 13:06

So you lead in to having all signs that go green, light, yeah, like we're ready. But that's not what happened.

SPEAKER_04 13:14

No, and I mean it's so it's so crazy when you look back at all the signs God had in place, and I think it's so important when you go through tragedy, when you go through something so significant in your life. I think it's really important to go back and look at how God had his hand. Look at the positives in all of the, you know, negative. It's so important. So my epidural came and I was like a nine. Like they shouldn't have even given me one. But my doctor fought them. Nope, she needs one, she needs one. You hear so often women don't get them. And they kept pushing, nope, we're gonna get her one. And I remember them telling me, like, I was waiting for it to kick in, and they're like, Can you hold off? Like, can you hold off? And I was like, Yep, I I think I can. I think thank goodness I did, yeah, because of all of the trauma that was to come. And so, again, just a little like they normally do not. They do not after eight, usually if you're dilated to an eight, sorry, nope, you're going. Okay. So something told me just wait, just hold off. And so it was a good three, they told me three to four minutes before it fully kicked in. And so once that did, we started pushing once, then twice. After the second push, our doctor was like, Okay, I I think we're we've got a shoulder that's stuck here. And so they do all of their things that's scary from a mother's point of view. You know, you look down, you're like, oh dear, what is she doing? Um, but you know, she was trying to position the baby a little bit better. Um, and then the words shoulder dystocia came out, and she said, I think that the baby's shoulders are just too broad for you to deliver. So it's a possibility we may have to break the clavicle bone. And so that right away runs through your head, like, oh my gosh, you know, the my baby's gonna be hurt, you know. Oh, you just so many different emotions go through. Um, and she I remember her saying, We've got uh a five-minute window to get baby out, and Oakland was born after three and a half minutes. It was so stressful at one point. She like took her glasses off and flung them across the room, like she was sweating and within seconds the room was standing room only.

SPEAKER_01 15:34

It was an emergency at that point. Yeah, so we went from happy go lucky to full-blown OB emergency within minutes, minutes people literally minutes in the room. We had no idea, or at least I had no idea what was going on and thought every I mean I like sorted it from what she was saying, but you know.

SPEAKER_04 15:51

Yeah. So Oakland was born. We didn't even know what we had. Like she was delivered, they brought her over to the warmer, and no cry, no cry, no cry, no cry for I mean, it seemed like 10 minutes. I'm sure it wasn't that long, but it was it was a a decent amount of time. Um, got to hear her cry, and I think it was then where we were like, what did we have? Like, we don't even know what we don't know what we had. Um, and we knew things still probably weren't great. They were wanting to wheel her off to um the NICU, and our doctor actually said, No, we have to take a family picture. And I was like, Oh, okay, like, yeah, you know, sure. And I had been crying, you know, because your baby's not breathing. And they bring her over, and we're both like just on cloud nine, you know. We just had a little girl, we had two boys, you know, like yeah, this is awesome. Looking back at that picture, like you really can see she she was very sick. She was so sick. And you could tell the Nikki was not okay with them taking that picture, but thank goodness she pushed for that. That's the only picture we have with her life. The only one. And so, um do you think she knew? Yeah. Oh, well, I don't know. I no, she didn't know that things were that bad because when they wheeled her off, they told me, you know, this happens, stuff like this happens, shoulder dystocia is not uncommon. Like they just are, you know, just go. She's all right. Check her out.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Yeah, within the window. So I don't think there was any reason to be completely alarmed at that point. Plus, I think there was a little element of they didn't know what was. I mean, I'm not saying they didn't know what was going on, but it all happened so fast.

SPEAKER_04 17:34

Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, we didn't know that there I was concerned. I kept texting him. Do not let them feed her formula. Like, I want to nurse her. Don't let them feed her. And little did I know on the other end.

SPEAKER_01 17:46

Well, I was the one that went to the NICU room with her, and um, you know, things uh started off kind of okay, and it was kind of the thought of, well, lots of people's babies go to the NICU and they're all fine. So there was still no reason to really freak out. Um, but while I was there by myself, um, you know, it just kind of it kind of became increasingly tense, and um, oh, I don't know, 15, 20 minutes afterwards, um, I noticed more people coming in there and her coloring wasn't a doctor, but I could tell like her coloring wasn't great, and they kept pushing on her skin and watching to see the color come back, uh, looking for her perfusion. Um, I don't that was the word I heard. And uh one of the nurses came up to me around that time. It was the nurse nurse practitioner, and she said, Your your baby's very sick. We're really worried about your baby. And at that point was the moment when like I can still remember that exactly like it was yesterday when I realized that this is this is bad. This is bad. And I so okay, so then I have the dilemma of Jessica is has no idea how serious things are because she's some of the stuff she's texting me. I still have those messages, they're really painful to look at, but I've got them. Uh, of uh it's excitement and should we tell my family, you know, whatever. Um, and you know, um, what do I do? What do I do? Because I can't freak her out. I don't know how serious it is, it sounds really serious. Um, she's getting fixed up, she's taking getting the aftercare that she's gotta get. So, like what what what am I supposed to do at this point? It was it was very difficult. Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 19:06

So Travis, you mentioned to me that when you were standing there looking in the window of of the um Nikue, and you were looking at your baby girl, there was another guy that came up and stood next to you or was in passing. Yeah, and he said something that that's jolted you into almost more of a panic.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

Or there was something he said. Yeah, well, there's a couple things that you're uncovering there. And and number one was um, okay, so Jessica's still getting uh fixed up and um things escalate pretty quickly. And uh I I don't remember because everything's kind of a blur, but within minutes, um they uh one of the beepers on their machine was going off, and then it was standing room only, and they told me to get out. And you know, at that time, I mean, it's hard to keep your cool at that point, so I I began pacing up and down the hall and praying out loud, which is not something I was really used to doing at that point, and hanging on nurses and you know, just kind of acting um uh frantic, I guess. And uh uh around that time, I think I kind of came back to my composure and came to the to to see what was going on, and they said, uh, should we start chest compressions? And then, you know, then I knew that we just went from really bad to uh the worst day of our life, probably. Um, and Jessica still has no idea what's going on. Um and around okay, so around that I think what you're getting at is around that time Jessica was still not over there yet. Uh maybe she was again, all that stuff's kind of a blur. I don't think you were though, but um, things are bad. The the room, standing room only, they just called out for chest compressions. They're giving our newborn baby CPR. Like, this can't be happening. This cannot be happening. Um, a guy, so the next the room adjacent to us was filled with another family, and a guy comes around the corner and looks at the chaos, and you can I can still remember that also. I can almost see him panic again, even though I'm in the midst of my own chaos. I think totally at looking back at it at this point, it was a god thing that I even saw this and was able to recognize what this guy was feeling. And he came around the corner, he took a deep breath, and he looked at the room and realized it wasn't his room, and he said, Oh, thank God that's not my room. And I heard that. I heard that. And even at the time, I remember thinking, How could he say that? This is my room. This is my room, and and my life is falling apart in front of my eyes right now. And uh it wasn't until later. I mean, I wasn't like, I remember not being mad, but just being like, really? Really? But it passed, he went in his room, and you know, I was back focused on what I needed to be focused on. But it wasn't until I went back through those events and kind of thought about that that, like, wow, like, okay, yeah, it wasn't his room. It wasn't his room, but that means that the previous night or the previous week, that was his room. And that feeling was very real for him. And um, you know, there's a lot of things that come to mind there, you just never know what somebody else is going through. Um, and similar with me, you know. He had even though it wasn't the right time for that, but he had been through a traumatic experience a day or two before. So um, you know, I guess the quick thing there is we never know what somebody else is walking through. Yeah. We can't, you know, judge.

SPEAKER_05 22:10

Yeah. Be gentle.

SPEAKER_01 22:11

Be gentle. Gentle. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 22:13

So after they start doing CPR on Sweet Little Oakland, what was the next because didn't they have to take her out and didn't they put her into surgery?

SPEAKER_01 22:25

Yeah, so about that time is when I went to get in uh this could be hours. So I went to go get Jessica thro for per the doctor's advice because I think they knew how serious it was. Yeah, he came with. Yep. Yep. We we went, I should have said.

SPEAKER_03 22:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:37

And uh got you and got you up to speed on, you know, this isn't gonna be the um story we were hoping to be able to tell everybody.

SPEAKER_05 22:45

Oh, Travis, what was that like to deliver that message to your bride?

SPEAKER_04 22:49

Uh I don't think you actually said anything the doctor did.

SPEAKER_05 22:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:52

You both walked in and he just looked at me and just said, you know, you're your little girl's very sick and we don't know what's wrong with her, and you need to come immediately.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 23:04

So they put me in a wheelchair, wheeled me up there, you know, wheeling up to those glass doors is it's so painful because you just part of me was like, I take it back, I don't want to be induced anymore. Let's go back. I I'll just wait. And you know, maybe things will be different if we just wait. You know, things were perfect. Like, how could this happen? Like, what what just happened? And yeah, so after um, you know, I mean, they they did everything, they did every test, ultrasound, yeah, every video, everything they have fancy gadgets um from the outside to try to figure out what was wrong with her because she was white as a ghost, and they were just giving her blood transfusion after blood transfusion, just pumping it in constantly. Um and couldn't figure out why she was still white with no like there was just no life in her. And so they decided to open her up um to do exploratory surgery, which is not something that ever happens on a baby.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

They said it was the first time at the time that they had ever opened up a baby for exploratory surgery. So this is open heart surgery, you know, they've done that kind of stuff before, but just yeah, to find out what's going on. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:19

So yeah, they open her up and um find this hemangioma on her liver that ruptured due to the pressure of being born. So with her shoulder dystocia, they had to use f external force um on my belly to push her out, and that's what ruptured it. Oh man. So um her heart stopped for an extensive amount of time.

SPEAKER_01 24:46

Yeah, there was a couple different times there.

SPEAKER_04 24:48

Extensive on the operating table. Um, she was too ill to remove it, so they patched it, thinking it would just buy them some time. Um got her back to the NICU. I mean, they came the doctor came to talk to us and was like, it's a miracle that she made it through.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

Um, but I think we're we're not in the clear, but he called us, he called us all together, and I thought we were gonna have our, you know, this is this is gonna turn out okay moment.

SPEAKER_04 25:17

Yeah. Um for sure.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:19

I mean, he even said, like, if you want to go grab something to eat, yep, go with your boys up to they gave the boys a nice room to stay in, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:27

Or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 25:28

Yep. And it wasn't more than 40 minutes maybe after that.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

I I my phone had been dead for a long time and people were getting, and I was like, I gotta go outside and get my phone charger. I know this is stupid, but at this point people want to know what's going on. And so I went to get my phone charger and I came back. That's how fast it was.

SPEAKER_04 25:43

Okay, I yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

We maybe chatted for a couple minutes before.

SPEAKER_04 25:46

I just yeah, they went me up to the room with the boys.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

I was met at the door with the uh Nikut nurse, and she said, You gotta get back up here, it's not good. So that's that's how quick it went back to bad.

SPEAKER_04 25:58

So they brought us up there and said that her uh patch had broken. So at that point, they could continue on with what they were doing with the blood transfusions. Um, but it just as they put it in, it just kept coming out. And so she was uh just getting bigger and bigger. And honestly, at that point, um yeah, we knew that it was it was time that it we couldn't continue to let her suffer.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

And there wasn't anything else that could be done.

SPEAKER_04 26:30

Yeah, there was nothing else they could could do. So um I always say it's like the hardest thing I'll ever do in my life, yet the most beautiful thing. I I got to hand my daughter over to Jesus, and so it was pretty awesome. I got to hold her for the first time, and um literally they put her in my arms and and she passed away right right then. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:56

The picture, and I'll I'll post this in the notes and make sure that our audience can see it, but the picture of you holding her and giving her a kiss is is so precious. And was it in that moment?

SPEAKER_04 27:08

Um so those those pictures, you know, they do a really good job up at the hospital, and I'm sure you know there's people who don't think so, but uh for us, we were um we were blessed to have a photographer be there and come in and take some pictures, and uh our boys got to be present for that, and um yeah. So after she passed away, a pivotal moment, I guess, for us, her neonatologist, who is forever, forever a big part of our life. He's uh an incredible man. He retired about a year after Oakland passed away, but um he came into the room. So that night was, I mean, such a blur because she passed away and I was exhausted. I mean, it was the middle of the night, like what, 12:30, 1 o'clock.

SPEAKER_03 28:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:02

And but yet I didn't want to miss out, like my time was going to be cut short with her. So I just I didn't want to miss a minute. So I I made myself stay awake and just stare at her and touch her and kiss her and all the things, and um that early next morning her neonatologist came in and and he just said to me that um he said this is something I don't tell a lot of people, but um, my wife and I lost a baby and he said it was our first. And he said he um they were just newly married, and he said that loss is what pushed him into neonatology. And he said, I just know God's gonna use this, he's gonna do something good with it. Oh, yeah. And and we're gonna talk about that in a second. Yeah. So I had a lot of great people up there.

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Well, that little piece was a huge part of Oh, it was. It was a pivotal moment. Even though it was really, really fresh, like that stuck with us that he did that because uh we could tell that that wasn't something that he always did. And I know that this listening to the story is probably painful for a lot of people, but um there's so much value in telling um your story, our stories.

SPEAKER_05 29:14

Yes, it is.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

And uh I think that's probably why you're having us do this.

SPEAKER_05 29:17

But yeah, it's it's the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

Yeah, for sure. So and that would that was illustrated by him coming into us. You didn't have to, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 29:24

The crazy thing, I actually did uh so a lot of the nurses up in the NICU, I did their hair. Like I've I'd known them for years, and they had worked with him their whole career and they had no idea. So that told you like he was led by the Holy Spirit to share that with me.

SPEAKER_00 29:42

Wow, and that planted a seed for you guys.

SPEAKER_04 29:46

Because when I got back home, all I I kept thinking was he was okay. He was okay. He made it through.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

He made it through the city.

SPEAKER_04 29:53

He made it, I'm gonna be okay too, eventually. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:57

And Travis, you're you so you guys have been married for what five years at this time? Uh uh six uh eight years. Uh six, seven and a half if we're at tech. Okay, perfect. And so you've got seven and a half years of being the the spiritual leader of the house and growing these predictionary mechanisms for your family. And I really resonate with what you went through in that moment where you're learning what's going on, and you're you're going, What do I do I tell my wife? What do I do? And I got and you stay here to get information, but she's over there and she's happy and you're torn in two different directions. For sure. And you know that time goes by so fast, so the kind of decision is kind of sorted out for you. Yes. But now you've got this long journey ahead of you. And what are you thinking? What's what's getting you through in the in that first uh say 24 12 hours? What's getting you through and how are you what's forming your decisions?

SPEAKER_01 30:58

Man, that that's a good question. Um, you know, looking looking back uh at that time, um I I I don't know that I was able I would have been able to, I don't know that four and a half years later I can still answer that question. Um, because my faith, uh I had some faith, but you know, it wasn't real strong at that point. Uh I wasn't doing a very good job probably of spiritually leading my house at that point. So, you know, there wasn't a whole lot of uh structure at that point in my life. But um I think uh the doctor that shared that information with us was probably really, really key. You know, even just talking with you guys, that was a huge deal. And um knowing, so then the other thing I know that I thought, and again, I don't know if it was a day or the next week or whatever, but okay, so there's nothing we can do to bring her back. There's things in our life that are outside of our control, and a lot of people can't let those things go. And it wasn't easy, but I realized that okay, so we can dwell on this terrible event for the rest of our lives and have it ruin us, or we can slowly pick up the broken pieces and put them back together. Now it was definitely not that clear, um, but that was sort of, I think, the direction that I was leaning and realizing um that this happened and we're gonna have to do something about it to survive. I mean, I know maybe people won't like me saying it like that, but there wasn't anything that could have been done otherwise. And, you know, what I had to figure something out.

SPEAKER_00 32:23

So in this way, there was a do you do you feel like it was natural for you to stand up and say, just this is a I mean, this is a challenge, right? There's something ahead of you, and you can either rise to the occasion or you can sink into a dark hole yourself. Yes. And I get just from your personality that you you rise to the occasion. Would you say so?

SPEAKER_01 32:40

Um that was really what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_04 32:42

I was gonna say now.

SPEAKER_01 32:43

I've been I've been in dark places in my life, and and uh 2017 wasn't exactly a great year for me. And so like I I feel like I was just coming off of a difficult season in my life, and there was probably uh the right things at the right times, and you know, I I feel very blessed uh to have gotten through, and when I say I, I'm talking about me, my whole family, but specifically me, that um I had whatever it was, it was obviously not me doing this, but whatever led me um to be able to get through those first few days. Um man, I don't know. I wish I could explain it better, but I it it was the Holy Spirit, but I didn't know it at the time. I really didn't. Yeah, it really needs we anymore. But uh the night that Oakland was having her surgery and and um I I took my family and uh my in-laws, I think my my own family was there to be a good one.

SPEAKER_04 33:31

This is what I was just wanting. I was like, I I want to talk.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

You want to tell the story? Go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 33:36

Well, no, I just uh for me a big moment uh I for me personally, and you don't see it right away, but uh a moment that I it was almost like a light switch um when I looked at my husband differently was when we were in the midst of this, you know, worst worst time of our life, and he gathered our family around and he prayed for us. He had never done that before.

SPEAKER_01 34:05

I don't think I'd ever prayed out loud, maybe like one time. Seven and every no, we didn't pray as a family. We didn't uh I mean I know I know I shouldn't be admitting that, but that's that's yeah. I know I'm tongue a little bit, you know, like pastors aren't supposed to admit I'm saying. But uh Yeah, I was not that's what I meant when I said I was not a great spiritual leader of my household. Uh, but there was enough faith, uh, or whatever it was that led me to take that step that we can't fix this, but maybe God can. And God didn't fix it the way that maybe we wanted to that night, but he's certainly shown us a lot of beauty through um faith.

SPEAKER_05 34:43

Yeah, and through your story, you guys have I mean, it's just gotten better and better and better.

SPEAKER_04 34:48

But he completely changed though. I mean when we left the hospital, uh you've never been like uh like really selfish, maybe a little bit. I think so. But I mean like when when we went home, you were no longer selfish at all. And he was the rock and the foundation, everything that I needed. I mean, you never once wavered in your support for me. You never once let my really bad days like ruin us. I don't know, you were that rock that I needed, but I think that all began with that praying. Like it just he was a different man from there forward.

SPEAKER_01 35:36

I did not like the alternatives, you know. I knew that we were in big trouble if if something didn't get done. And I I don't think I could have put it into his the thoughts that I would like to have now, but like I knew something different. Uh this this this required a different approach. And I wish I would have said that I just cracked open my Bible and started reading it, it wasn't quite that simple. Um, but yeah, yeah, something this was a circumstance we've never seen before.

SPEAKER_04 36:00

Yeah, for sure. But I think we also knew as a couple, I did anyway. Um we weren't if we were gonna continue on the way that we were before Oakland, we would not make it. Yeah. Period. So I don't like we didn't it's not like we like all of a sudden said, we need to have a meeting of the minds and we need to decide if we're gonna like we just both knew like we cannot continue on the way that we were.

SPEAKER_01 36:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:27

Because we were straight for, I mean, we were headed straight f for divorce.

SPEAKER_00 36:33

And there in this world there are so many things that you can turn to. Drugs, alcohol, pornography, things like that. Yeah. And I I get to sense that there are many families where that does go. Oh, for sure. Can you speak to the families? Can you speak to the to the to the men listening who have gone through something similar and they're feeling convicted? They're feeling like they didn't make those right decisions in those first hours. Can you speak speak to them and and give them some encouragement?

SPEAKER_01 36:59

Yeah, yeah. Um, again, I don't know how good I'll be with my words, but uh I would say that hope is never far off. It's it's never too late. And um I know in those situations it's easy to lean into what we've always done, what makes us comfortable.

SPEAKER_03 37:15

Earthly sin.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

Earthly, yeah, earthly sin. Um, because we want to do something that's gonna take away the pain. And I think some of that um is is that men these days have forgotten, or maybe we don't know what it's like to suffer, uh, that life is hard and we're gonna have to go through difficult things. And relying on the things that have gotten us into the suffering uh that have gotten us this far um aren't gonna work anymore, and we're gonna have to make a decision at some point. And I know that that's really difficult for people because what we have been doing feels good or makes us feel better, or it's an escape for us, or whatever, but for a short time. Yeah, it it's always temporary and it leads and it ends up leading to more suffering. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 37:58

So So you're gonna so your marriage was fine. It was fine. You were in a marriage for seven and a half years, you had two boys, you were going about. It wasn't fine. Yeah. But when I I should say by the world standards, it was fine.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Okay. That's what I mean.

SPEAKER_05 38:11

But from an earthly standpoint, it's like, eh, we're kind of going through the motions, but not having the resources or the tools to understand how incredible a marriage can be if you don't have all that. If you don't have something that brings you together, like what you've experienced. Because what I've heard you guys say over and over is like you you love each other, you got married, and you're living your life. And this profound experience that you went through, which is which is true. I mean, it was a that's a tragedy. It's one of the hardest things. And it, I mean, people who've lost a child, there's many people that still, I mean, years, 11, 12, 13, 15 years later, are still in the mourning process and cannot get out. Cannot release, can't, and it's because I've in talking with some of those people, they don't have the resources or the community or the people that have wrapped their arms around them and said, we can do this, you can get out of this. Right. And leading by faith, leading with the truth, the biblical truth of like how Christ centered, because your your relationship went from earthly fine to, I mean, it looking at the two of you across the table right now, I'm going, like, yeah, but this is four and a half years later.

SPEAKER_01 39:26

Yeah, it's taken a lot of time. You know, the first couple of years were really, really difficult. And I don't think our our marriage was better right away. It's not like it was just fixed immediately. It was a process. And um, you know, I think I was scared, I don't know if I can speak for you on this, but I was scared enough of what could happen. And we heard enough of the um this ruined my family, and um, we don't want that to happen to you. So we had we had a support system in place for sure, or that um uh came by our side and stuff, but we heard enough of the this ruined my family. Well, we had two beautiful boys, and we had two beautiful boys that we knew that this is either gonna make or break them.

SPEAKER_04 40:01

It would destroy their whole life.

SPEAKER_01 40:03

They're old enough to remember and yeah, yeah, for sure.

unknown 40:07

Yep.

SPEAKER_05 40:07

So Jess, I remember a conversation with you about walking out of that hospital. And that was kind of a moment where you realized there was no, there was, there was nothing for you to carry out of that hospital. Like you went in pregnant and you watched all these other women walking out, the people putting their babies in the back of the car, watching these families leave with exactly what they came into the hospital. They went in with a purpose, they came out with and yet you guys were walking out without Oakland. And that moment, you kind of it kind of was like a switch for you of this can't happen to other people. This can't happen to other mothers or other families. Like this is this experience is so painful, yeah, that I am gonna do whatever. And maybe it didn't happen in that moment, but I remember you saying that, and that's kind of what I feel like that was like the first seed for the Oakland Foundation.

SPEAKER_01 41:00

You didn't know it's kind of like the doctor coming in and talking to us. You probably didn't know what it was.

SPEAKER_04 41:04

I mean, it started already when they uh, you know, oh it's so awful. Like they keep telling you, okay, like we chose to have an autopsy for Oakland because we wanted to make sure that our boys were gonna be okay. We didn't know if this was a genetic thing, and then they'd be wrestling on the floor and like well, we wanted to know what happened. Yeah, and at that time in our life, we were like, it's crazy. And I talked to a lot of people that feel this way, like, well, we we'll have more kids. We're gonna have another baby. So I want to know if that baby's gonna be okay. And so leaving that NICU after like saying, Okay, one more hour, one more hour, one more hour, you finally walk out and you go down to like the postpartum floor, you know, where they have like all like the bistro and like all the moms are happy and the dads are you know on cloud nine. And they put us down there, and we have a dragonfly on our door, so you know clearly we don't have a baby. That's what they do, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:03

Well, and who who knows what that means?

SPEAKER_04 42:05

I mean, yeah, maybe at the time I didn't know what that means, but I knew that the thing on our door, nobody else had.

SPEAKER_01 42:10

With the general population though, like this is I I went to the Beach Draw to get some food and I met a high school friend that I hadn't seen since high school, and they just had a baby, and like talk about awkward. I mean, because how terrible for him to, you know, they're excited they just had a baby and have to ask me and me say, Well, ours passed away, you know, like that shouldn't for both of us for neither one of us that shouldn't happen. Right. So I think that was another thing that we had talked about. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 42:34

I mean, I know we were sitting in there and like I was waiting for this nurse to come check me out one more time, and you could hear babies crying, and I was like, get me out of here, get me out of here now. And the nurse came in and I'm like, I need to go. Like, you need to get me out of here. And she was like, Okay, you know, you've had other kids, so I think we're good. Why don't you just leave and call us if you have any problems? But yeah, it was going uh, you know, down the same elevator I went down with my voice. It was, you know, walking with a diaper bag and you know, this empty car seat and stuff, and you go, you go down to the lobby, and there sat a mom with a baby and she's holding it in the wheelchair, just like you see in the movies, you know. And there she's just you know on cloud nine, and I'm sitting there just an absolute mess waiting for you to pull up with the car. And yeah, I knew that something had to change. But yeah, that's just awful.

SPEAKER_05 43:29

Mom shouldn't have to go through that. No, that whole process sounds horrific. I mean, I can't I mean, I am so sorry that you two had to go through that because that I personally that just gives me this oh, I want to kick into action. What do we gotta do? How can we fix that for future moms? Because that is not okay. Yeah. And until someone says, hey, I that's not that's not okay. It's just they don't know. But they don't know, they don't, you know. And so it we it's we have it's already we're 42 minutes in, which I want to still we're gonna extend this just to another 10 minutes for those for the listeners. So this is gonna be an extended because maybe there's gotta be a part two. Yes, there can be. And then I I'm just gonna make sure in all the show notes and everything that we really ex expand and expound on the Oakland Foundation because it's such a beautiful thing. How that doctor spoke into your life that day is exactly what happened when you refer to him and I think about all the wonderful things you're doing now. If if you can just go through uh briefly, briefly. Briefly, I know that's gonna be super hard. But when I look at the things you guys do, so the Oakland Foundation, you have the Wade Bears. Yep. So the Wade Bears and care packages, and you have location kits and angel outfits, and you're throwing events to raise money, and you're uh the event you that you're doing is such a beautiful event. Uh so if you can just ex just talk about that.

SPEAKER_04 44:58

Yeah, yeah. So we found much like a lot of people that go through trauma, you need to talk about it. You know, and your child that passed deserves to be talked about and honored every day. And what we found is the more that we talked about her, the more joy and excitement and it was just it became easier to talk about her. And so we do a lot. And she's talked about just as much as our our boys at home.

SPEAKER_01 45:26

That's right. But we found out that that was not the norm that people were not doing that.

SPEAKER_04 45:29

Right away we found that. And I I started to see these women who had had babies 30, 40, 50 years ago that had never talked about them, and their families didn't even know that they had this baby, and they were gonna take it to the grave with them. And it's like, no, we need to talk about it. And the minute that they would say their name, their shoulders relaxed and tears would just flow, and it's like they waited their whole life to be able to share their child with someone else. And so that's how the Oakland Foundation was started, and that's our mission is to break the stigma of throwing it in the closet and not talking about it. Um, bringing together a community of lost mamas that can share all of the stories, the good, bad, and the ugly, and have a community that they can rally around. Um and that just it's never gonna heal your heart, but it it sure helps to just mend it a little bit in the process.

SPEAKER_05 46:27

And the bears that I love that because I've been able to bless someone with a weighed bear and explain what you do with that.

SPEAKER_04 46:36

So we received our Oakland bear the day of Oakland's funeral, actually. Yep. Um, and long story short, we ended up taking over the rights to these bears. Uh, nonprofit had closed their doors, and so they weigh the exact same as the child that passed. Uh, we can do them anywhere from under a half pound to around nine and a half, is about as big as I like to go. Um, but yeah, we signed a big contract with Stanford, so now every mom that leaves the hospital leaves with a weighted bear in their hands, so they don't have to leave empty-handed.

SPEAKER_05 47:06

Which is a stuff, it's like a stuffed animal that has um you put it.

SPEAKER_04 47:11

So we fill it. Yep, yep. Yep, we fill them out and um we saw what it did.

SPEAKER_01 47:16

Soothing lavender. I mean, it's not just a bear.

SPEAKER_04 47:18

No, it's not just a bear. No, these are these are loved on, they're preyed on. Um, I mean, I I throw my heart and soul into these, and they have, I think, is the reason why our oldest son uh was able to heal. I mean, we're so we're camping and we have Oakland bear.

SPEAKER_01 47:35

Oh yeah, she's there with us, she's and they say they call her Oakland. They don't say the Oakland bear. I mean, that that that's her. Um our other son has a blanket that, you know, so she's very much still a part of their lives.

SPEAKER_04 47:47

And that's how everyone should be able to do it.

SPEAKER_01 47:49

Yeah, and it it just about brings a tear to my eye every time that they talk about her like that. And it it's just talk about your situations, talk about your stories, talk about your pain, talk about your suffering because other people uh will be encouraged through it.

SPEAKER_04 48:02

Yeah, you don't know um what kind of prison someone else is living in. And by sharing your story, it could break them free of the chains that are holding them down and yourself. Yeah, for sure. And yeah.

SPEAKER_05 48:17

Keep going, because I'm I can't talk right now. But that's what it's all about.

SPEAKER_01 48:22

It's just yeah, we've just found so many different times uh that we will we are have been rewarded um in we've messed up a ton of stuff, don't don't hear me wrong. But like rewarded in um God has blessed us. Yeah, being open with our story and uh being an open book as you call it, even though you're more of an open book than me. I'm like kind of a half-closed, half-open book. But uh there there's power because life life is hard. Um and you maybe you you won't lose a child, but you'll experience something very difficult that'll rock your life or rock your marriage if you haven't already. Brace yourself and um just you know, people need to hear other people's story to know that they're not alone.

SPEAKER_04 49:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:02

And Heather, you mentioned it earlier, like suicide rates, depression rates, anxiety rates are through the roof right now uh because of all the isolation and marriage rates social media, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 49:12

60% of marriages fail after the loss of a child.

SPEAKER_01 49:15

I thought it was higher than that, but whatever so okay, so let's just call it 60%. I mean, that's that's that's scary stuff, and we know that 50% of first-time marriages end in divorce even without a child that passed away.

SPEAKER_05 49:25

So think about that. You're not only losing a child, you're now losing your spouse. Your family is not broken apart. I mean, there's so much more trauma. So much more pain. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 49:34

Your kids then are going to see an unhealthy marriage, and they probably are going to enter into their own unhealthy, you know.

SPEAKER_05 49:42

It's they're rep they're repeating the cycle. Yeah. What I've heard, this is such a beautiful story. Thank you for sharing all that you have. I mean, this has turned into a beautiful marriage. You're a pastor. Yeah, you're crazy. Into people's lives every single time. I I just love calling you Pastor Travis. Oh, Pastor T. Pastor T. I haven't been able to see you behind the pulpit yet, but I I decided to see that happen. Um, because what a blessing that God has. I mean, you're living in the spirit, speaking into everyone's lives daily now. Like he has transformed the Travis, yeah, that Travis into this Travis. And it's it's a beautiful transformation. And then I mean, your heart behind the bears and the foundation and the way you're speaking into these women's lives and opening up a world they didn't even know existed.

SPEAKER_04 50:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 50:33

To watch the the two of you and the mom. Like the mom, I mean, it there's there's something there, right? They always say that it's you that it this baby is a part of you physically. There is yeah, there is that connection that is something that is unbearable to to break or to not have there. So when you lose a child, so through the event, how you honor these women by this annual fundraising event that you do, you uh you have the the moms who have lost children actually walk the runway, is that correct?

SPEAKER_04 51:02

Yeah, that's my favorite event. So we put on a lot of events throughout the year, but Beauty and Babes is my favorite. So we have it coming up again April 2nd. And we're just signing papers to have it out at Emerald Pines Barn. And we have uh all moms who have lost our models, and uh, we have them closed in local boutiques and it's a runway show, but it's a chance for these moms to gather, and it's just it is so beautiful. So they'll be up and they get their hair and makeup done, and they're just sitting together and they're just talking about their loss, and it is just it's really beautiful, and they have made some of the best friends within this community, and uh it's it's really cool to witness the connection and the family for sure. Yep, yep. Yeah, I Oakland's story is um I mean it's sad. It it's we have our hard days too, but I would not change a single thing about it because she has changed the world in a matter of 10 hours of being born. And I'm the lucky one that gets to live out her legacy every day. And I always say, like, it's it's gonna be the most beautiful thing when I get to see her again, and I can't wait for that. But until then, I'm just gonna keep telling the world all about her. No, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:22

But for those of you listening out there, I think it's important to note that those uh going through those details that you heard in the first 20 minutes or so uh were particularly painful for me. It's not easy. So it it you have to push through the hard of telling your story, and I don't think it ever, depending on you know what happened in the circumstances and what your past is like, it'll probably never get super easy to tell your story, but just know that somebody out there is listening to that and somebody out there needs to hear that, and somebody else is walking a similar path, and it's gonna be encouraged by your perseverance through difficult times. So I just I just wanted to mention that because those details uh from the first part of the podcast were particularly difficult to recall. I don't like to go down memory lane, if you will, that particular memory lane very often. Uh, but I know that there's uh great reward every time that you do that, and you don't have to tell the whole story every time. You know, sometimes we just tell a little bit of it, but uh, you know, uh Heather opened the choke and pulled the cord for the whole story. So you got the whole story today. But there there's there's reward and and hope is never far off.

SPEAKER_05 53:21

Yeah. I really appreciate you sharing the whole story. Because I I mean, whenever I go have to go back into my dark closet, is you know the wounds, man, it is hard, but it is so beautiful. Yeah. The the the beauty that comes out of sharing and building a community around your your it's your story. Yeah, it's your story. Thank you for continuing to just live Oakland's legacy, you guys. This is thank you for having us. Thanks for having us. This is so fun. Thank you. I love you guys so much. Oh, we love you. You're stuck with us for life, forever. Thanks for doing what you do. Yeah, thank you everyone for tuning in. Uh, I will make sure to post everything there is to know about the Rimmies and the Oakland Foundation. And um, have a wonderful day.